[REJECTED] Cataclysm raids overpowered! Dragon Soul in particular.

[ShadowPussDomination]

Greetings everyone
I am opening this topic because many people had trouble with old content raids recently. Results that 5.4 update also afected Dragon Soul and other Cata raids (for no reason). I'd like to point the atention mainly to Dragon Soul. For some reason the bosses do a lot more damage as they should having in mind the gear we have now compared to the one we used in Cataclysm. Some of the boss mechanics are not working properly but the main reason for this is the missing debuff that every boss in Dragon Soul should have - "Demoralazed".

I read lots of topics on Retail and watched many videos of doing Dragon soul in 5.4. Seems like there is always a debuf (nerf) for all the bosses. Lets say that in decent gear five people are enough for dragon soul 10 players normal, even less than 10 players with good PVE gear can score a heroic run. As for Freakz... you need full group of 10 people and also they should have around 490 ilvl so they can catch up and 500+ to make the run. Of course... Noone is joining the raids... I recieve whispers like... "Dude this is cata raid... Why 500 ilvl ?!", "WTF IS THAT ILVL IDIOT", etc. As I said earlier some of the boss mechanix are failing, but its still doable. Maybe that debuff that I am requesting will compense for the misworking mechanics / bugs that did not exist on Cata.
Here is a proof video of the bosses and the debuff on them. As you can see with SoO gear this guy is soloing 25h DS.


I will explain my observations about every boss in Dragon Soul 10 heroic:
- Morchok:
1) The first few stomps are OK. The next ones are absolute blast - around 450-600k per player no matter where you stay. Share or not the stop with the tank.
2) Crystal link doesn't work properly. Close or far from the boss the crystal link you get is absolutely random. You can also get linked by 2 crystals at the same time from both bosses.

- Warlord Zon'Ozz:
1) High amount of damage and the ball bounces are weird and not always always hit the boss.

- Yor'Sashj: - Everything seems to be working fine with this one.

- Hagara the Stormbringer:
1) For all the 4 times I had the chance to kill this boss in MOP, we only get to enter only 1 phase. All the times that was Frost phase and seems to work fine. I guess the Lightning phase won't be any different.

- Ultraxion: Works fine. Imo...

- Warmaster Blackhorn:
1) Works fine until the actual Warmaster comes down on the ship. It's all going notmal but at some point the boss becomes unable to target so you have to reset jump out of the ship and redo. Tip: Please have in mind that in order to kill it you also have to attack goriana until she flies away, then you switch to WMB. That time also counts and there is a chance for the Warmaster to become inattackable. Sometimes it works but most of the times it bugs out. Once it bugs, it means: No boss kill, no loot, no continuing of the raid. There is another small bug that when Goriana is low enough, she flies away as she should. But then it comes back unable to be targeted and does damage.

- Spine of Deathwing:
1)The encounter seems to be working fine, but... There is an important part of the fight where dispeller MUST dispell a debuff called "Blood Corruption: Death" (https://www.wow-freakz.com/spells.php?spell=106199 (wowhead link)) and that debuff jumps to other few targets etc. It was that part where priests used to spam mass dispellball the time. That is now impossible since dispells have now 6-10 sec cd, and mass dispell has 15 if I remember well.

Madness of Deathwing: Never realy got that far on MOP because of Spine.

I peronally think that not everything should be perfectly fixed but at least make it doable. Like for example Warmaster target bug, Spine debuff that kills everyone and there is no way to get enough dispellers since we have cd, or apply the demoralizing debuff. Should be easier since it's content from an older expansion. If Freakz can apply Demoralazing debuff for 90lvl ourdated raid from a previous patch, why can't they apply the same debuff for older raids.

I'd love to get this fixed because there aren't any other options to get the gear provided from DS yet. Sincerly hope that ilvl for items that can be obtained by vote increases so we vote for items until at least 416ilvl as it was in cata with ICC items.

Have a nice time playing.

[ShadowPussDomination]

Update: Today I saw that saw that the buff is there but affects only trash mobs, not bosses. If this is getting fixed would be great in first place

[Vinsel]

As you said some bosses have way too much damage, but others are ok. I can confirm it since I tried to do DS 10 heroic yesterday, and also can confirm the WMB bug because it happened a couple of times.
But as you said DS is not the only one with that problem. I will try to gather info for other raids and compare it to freakz's raids.

PS: I think there is a post in PVE section about Pre-MoP raids, you should check it and post it there as you did here.

Update: I found this post on battle.net about Dragon Soul raid after MoP launch (if I'm not wrong )

Quote:

Dragon Soul Difficulty Change - 30% Blizzard Entertainment 7/12/2012 545 Once scheduled server maintenance is completed during the week of July 17, the “Power of the Aspects” spell will grow more powerful, reducing the health and damage dealt of all enemies in the Dragon Soul raid by 30%. This spell has grown progressively stronger over time to reduce difficulty and make the encounters more accessible. The spell will affect both normal and Heroic difficulties. It will not affect the Raid Finder difficulty. If you don’t need the help of the Dragon Aspects, the spell can be disabled by talking to Lord Afrasastrasz at the beginning of Dragon Soul. We hope you continue to enjoy Dragon Soul, and that these changes encourage you to attempt a higher difficulty, or just keep pushing to take down that next boss.

Here is the Link to the Blizzard post: Dragon Soul Difficulty Change

[ShadowPussDomination]

Well I couldn't find any other place to post this so I put it here.

As for the post from "battle.net" - Thank you. I tried to find this but I couldn't. I think it will be enough if we get that debuff applied on the bosses and fix for those with the disappearing target and the Spine debuff that doesn't scale with the game mechanics anymore. No complicated difficulty selections are needed. That should do in my opinion.

[Vinsel]

Well some people might like to choose between the "hard" and the "easy" way to complete the raid. I think taht if they start with applying the debuff to the bosses will be a good beggining and then they can work on the system to change between the "hard" and the "easy" way for the raid.
If some GM can give his opinion would be great

PS: I'm still looking for the armor values and the damage done for all the Pre-MoP raids, and some patch-notes that can be useful.

Update: Stomp @Morchok damage seems to be ok, but he doesn't have the buff applied. The damage/health is still the same.

Proofs:
Freakz:
Freakz's Screenshot
Retail:
Video form Retail


As you can see in the retail video, Morchok has 23,400,128 HP and here it has 28,738,169 HP Freakz's Morchok. Couldn't find a DB for MoP with the Morchok stats sadly, I hope the video from retail is enough.

[Ashcool]

We never had the buff working on Freakz. Will see what I can do about it.

Ashcool - TEMPORARY UNAVAILABLE - Please contact Denim.

[Vinsel]

Ashcool wrote:

We never had the buff working on Freakz. Will see what I can do about it.

Thanks for looking into it

[ShadowPussDomination]

The debuff is working but only on trash mobs. For some reason does not applies to bosses. Target any trash mob in DS and you will see the debuff.

[Vinsel]

ShadowPussDomination wrote:

The debuff is working but only on trash mobs. For some reason does not applies to bosses. Target any trash mob in DS and you will see the debuff.

Yeah, that's right I forgot to take a ss of that

Anyway, the npcs have the debuff which decrease health and damage done, but as far I could see, the debuff only affect to melee damage, because the trash makes like 30-40k spell damage. So I guess the debuff only affect Health and Melee Damage. If someone can confirm this will be great


Update:

I got the ss of the debuff in the NPCs which is the same one for the bosses Debuff Proof
Also got a ss of the damage done by the trash (melee and spell), and as I said before the debuff seems to affect only to melee damage as you can see in this screenshot

[ShadowPussDomination]

I dont understand much of a GM stuff but I don't think it is that complicated to apply the debuff to the bosses. Even if it doesn't affect the spells, Its enough when you get lower HP and physical damage.

I remember you joining my raid last night, and we can both agree that 15 people failed to score 25H Morchok run when on retail one man does it. On Freakz is absolute blast in the balls, but what ca nwe do...

Realy hope that it gets fixed soon since it's "Old Content".

I would also like to know if the GM needs some sort of a proof in particular about any other test that we can try. I might by able to gather some information about it.

[Vinsel]

ShadowPussDomination wrote:

I dont understand much of a GM stuff but I don't think it is that complicated to apply the debuff to the bosses. Even if it doesn't affect the spells, Its enough when you get lower HP and physical damage. I remember you joining my raid last night, and we can both agree that 15 people failed to score 25H Morchok run when on retail one man does it. On Freakz is absolute blast in the balls, but what ca nwe do... Realy hope that it gets fixed soon since it's "Old Content". I would also like to know if the GM needs some sort of a proof in particular about any other test that we can try. I might by able to gather some information about it.

Yeah I remember it. I was able to solo DS 10n with less than 490 ilvl in retail, but as far I can remember, the buff only affect melee damage and health. I'm still looking for something that proof it but I didn't found anything at the moment. I will update this whenever I find any useful info.
I don't care how long it takes to apply the buff and as my friend said, if you need some test, proof, etc. ask it here and we will try to provide it

[ShadowPussDomination]

Bump

[Vinsel]

Bump! Any news?

Discord en Español
Facebook de Freakz ES

[Burebysta]

I finally managed to look into this issue and results are:

Morchok:
- Stomp works fine. Why?

Quote:

Morchok performs a massive stomp, splitting 675000 damage between all players within 25 yards. Morchok's current target and their closest ally will take a double portion of the damage.

-Crystal Link, yeah I've seen some issues but they are random and it's not that game breaking or impossible

Warlord Zon'ozz:
-Void of the Unmaking's only issue that I found is the speed movement but it might be just fooling with me

Quote:

When the Void collides with a player it diffuses, inflicting 135000 Shadow damage split evenly between nearby players. The force of this diffusion causes the void to ricochet in the opposite direction, and the absorbed souls increase the damage the Void inflicts by 20% per diffusion.

Warmaster Blackhorn:
-Yes, he becomes un-targetable and there's the message "Encounter failed" but the fight still goes on. If you reset the encounter another message of "Encounter failed" will appear. Somehow he gets out of/exits combat/the encounter thus bugging out.

Spine:
-Sadly, check this https://youtube.com/watch?v=W9_bIAsDDRw:

(at the beginning)
The mechanic is the same on Blizzard even if it's a guaranteed-wipe if solo. We cannot change as it requires time modifying the script, making tests that it works and roll it out and you should know that our top priority is Actual content.

Madness:
-I can assure you it works.




Final conclusion? Only two confirmed bugs: WMB un-targetable in the middle of the fight and bosses missing the debuff. The scripts for DS are the same from Cataclysm, no changes. What I want to underline is that being a tier-raid one step behind MoP it is indeed easier but not necessarily solo-able or MUCH easier, and we all know that some boss fights (pointing at Spine) are still messy, buggy and frustrating even on Retail.
I shall inform the Staff to fix those two issues.